Episode 45

full
Published on:

4th Apr 2024

Female Power in the Property World - Lucy King

In this Episode we are talking to the lovely Lucy King from Gelar Property.

Lucy and I delve into inspiring discussions featuring Lucy King, a seasoned surveyor excelling in a typically male-dominated industry.

We emphasise the balance between business life and self-care.

Learn about overcoming challenges, importance of mentorship, managing that wonderful 'work-life' balance, and fostering personal well-being for success and happiness.

We also chat about donoughts!

You can find the lovely Lucy at the following places:

LinkedIn: (2) Lucy King | LinkedIn

Website: Home | Gelar Property | Commercial Property Advice and Services

You can keep up to date with the host Helen here:

https://linktr.ee/Helencorsicadmore

Liked this episode? Remember to subscribe and leave a review! Or if you want to be a guest then contact me at hello@helencorsicadmore.com

Thank you,

Hels x

Transcript
Speaker:

Hello and welcome to another

episode of Fabless and Female.

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Today, I am delighted to be joined

by the lovely, lovely Lucy King.

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Lucy and I,, met by chance at

a networking event, um, going

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back now about 18 months ago.

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And I really wanted to get Lucy onto

the podcast because Lucy is a qualified

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chartered surveyor with over 20

years commercial property experience.

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Lucy is also the owner and founder

of property consultancy Gellar

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Property and also the co owner of

Borkham Property Compliance, both of

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which are in their scale up stages

of growth, which is super exciting.

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Lucy is fortunate to be enough to

have worked in both the private

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practice and client side for a

number of corporate entities across

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the UK, including more recently

the well known brand Halfords PLC.

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And in her guise, Lucy is now proud

to be working for some big blue chip

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occupier clients, including the Scoffs

Group, which if you've never heard

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of them, is one of Costa Coffee's

largest franchisee, Linnaeus Veterinary

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Group, owned by Mars Pack Care.

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Helping Hands Home Care and Pure

Electric, just to name a few.

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When she's not busy running the two

businesses, she can be found out

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riding the family's horses with her

two tweenage girls, Ellen and Georgie,

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or walking the family dog, um, with

her very patient husband, Rich.

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So lovely to have you, welcome,

and welcome to Pockets Lucy.

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Thank you very much, Helen.

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Thank you very much for having me.

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I am a podcast virgin.

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So yeah, I'll get it out there now

whilst we're talking now at the start.

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Well, I wanted to have you on

because I've never had anybody that's

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really worked in property before.

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And I think it's really important to

have a broad range of people on the

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podcast, but also your industry, from

my opinion, is very male dominated.

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And I thought, do you know what?

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Lucy has done plenty

amazing in her role so far.

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And then when I said like 20 years

experience, I'm like, oh my god,

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that just shows like my age as well.

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We're similar in age, aren't we?

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I think.

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Um, yeah.

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So, before we get into more about

your, um, your professional side

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of, of your life, I'm going to ask

you a couple of quickfire questions.

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I've only just started doing

this and I actually love it.

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It's a lot easier.

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Okay, cool.

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I'm ready.

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You're ready.

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You're like hit me up with it.

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Okay.

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So first things first.

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Dark or milk chocolate?

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Oh, see milk chocolate is, I

love, but it's really bad for you.

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It's got so much sugar in and Rich

has been trying to get me to eat more

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dark chocolate because otherwise,

you know, you know, when you open a

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bar at Cowbray, you're like, Breeze.

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Chocolate . Yeah.

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Gone within like a second.

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Exactly.

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Whereas you open something like the

green and Blacks, which is a bit

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more expensive, but you can actually

savor it and you can have a couple

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more pieces rather than it all go.

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So it means that when you go in

the cupboard the next day, it'll

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still be there rather than you

decimating a bar of Cadburys.

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So, right.

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So go on.

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My heart says milk, my head says mush.

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Now, once you start to love dark

chocolate like I do, it doesn't stay

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in the cupboard for the next day.

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It is literally gone.

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It is literally gone.

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Bam.

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Right.

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Yeah.

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No.

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Okay, so we've gone the chocolate.

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Right, now, this will be a test.

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Salt and vinegar crisps

or cheese and onion.

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Okay.

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Oh, see, I like both.

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Yeah, I don't know.

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I've got a favorite.

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I think they're on an equal playing field.

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I, I could, yeah.

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If you chuck smoky bacon in,

then they would adapt it to

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be my favorite every time.

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I would never chuck smoky bacon in, ever.

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It would be like the bottom of the pile.

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Corn cocktail can do one, but

smoky bacon, yeah, I love it.

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Oh, okay.

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Yeah, equal playing field.

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Equal playing.

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All right then.

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Um, Beach, snow.

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Oh, they, again, these are really

hard because as you know, I love

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my ski holiday and every year

I love my beach holiday too.

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But we had this debate when we were away

skiing actually, my husband and I, and

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I, I think for me, As much as I love

skiing, I think it would be the beach.

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Yeah, good.

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Bit of sun, not too much, you know,

with wind protection, good for

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your, you know, Especially with the

weather over here, is it isn't it?

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It's so much.

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So yeah, I'd say as much as I absolutely

cannot miss a ski holiday, to me,

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the beach and that bit of sunshine.

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Yeah, I think, do you know what?

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It's interesting, Mike, because I reckon

if we lived in a, a warmer country or we

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had our definite seasons and they didn't

just last for like months and months and

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months and months of rain we'd probably

be more like yeah let's go you know skiing

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but actually because we don't get it

yeah it's like oh anyway okay last one

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tea or coffee Oh, I can't drink coffee.

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So my tea is absolutely, there we are.

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That's a dead sit.

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I wish having run two businesses and with

two small children, I could drink coffee.

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But yeah, tea, tea, tea, tea, tea.

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Yeah, half, half a cup, half a

teaspoon of sugar, not half a cup.

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Half a cup?

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What's the point?

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What's the point?

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Oh, half a cup of sugar?

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Yeah, you'd be flying.

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You wouldn't need the coffee.

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Exactly.

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So no, half, half a teaspoon of

sugar, a little drop of milk.

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It's got to be absolutely

skimmed milk, nothing else.

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So yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

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There we go.

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Right.

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Isn't this interesting?

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So I'm sure the audience will already

know a little bit more about Lucy.

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She can't make a decision.

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And she nearly likes half a cup of sugar.

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Anyway, right, that's so interesting.

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Okay, let's go back to what

the podcast is all about.

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So business, balance and burnout.

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So let's take a step back.

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So when I introduced you, um, with

your professional bio, what I'd

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love to know is what really inspired

you to get into that industry?

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or the industry you're in.

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Yeah it's funny because I get, I get

often asked this question because is,

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as I, and I see it with my children

now, it's kind of this decision where

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do you, where does that seed start in

terms of you're in school and, and, and

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everything else and it's funny because

I always, as a child, wanted to be, um,

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my parents laughed, my husband laughed

at me with this, is that I either

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wanted to be a doctor or a solicitor.

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And I loved sort of the thing of

knowing about people's, you know,

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bodies and sort of just about

illnesses and all that kind of stuff.

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And I used to love a conversation around

the dinner table with my brother in law

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when he was in medical school about, about

what's the worst thing he's ever seen.

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Oh my god, can you share?

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Well, yeah, I can, and I'll come back

in a minute because it's always quite

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funny, because it was always funny

looking at my husband's face when

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when we were obviously just still

boyfriend and girlfriend at this point

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in time, and him being very squirmish.

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He hated that conversation.

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Me too!

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I know.

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So Dark Zoo was always

something I fancied.

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Plus solicitor and it's, I always

felt, and it's wrong, it's wrong

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to say this, but I always thought,

Oh, I'm never going to be that

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clever enough to be either of those.

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So I don't know what, you know,

maybe I started as a youngster.

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It's funny.

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But then I, I don't know, I started

doing a bit of, sort of, um, summer

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work and then got a Saturday job in

Darlow's Estate Agent back in the day.

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Yeah.

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You know, showing people around houses

and I loved having a nose in people's

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houses and, you know, taking people out.

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It's better than working

in a shop than just Yeah.

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Landing behind serving customers

and I really enjoyed that but I

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thought oh my god, I'm the kind

of person who can't sit still.

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No.

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I know, right, isn't it?

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And I kind of thought is it

going to get a bit boring just

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showing people around houses?

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Not that I, you know, underestimate the

role an estate agent does in any way.

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Because I know you've done that.

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I have done that for many years, yeah.

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And, you know, but I just thought,

am I going to get a bit bored?

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Is it going to, you know, I

want something a bit more scope.

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And yes, you could have gone

down a bit more of the, you know,

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residential property development

route, that side of things.

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But then one of our family friends

had a property development business,

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a commercial property development

business based in North Cardiff.

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Yeah.

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And he is still a family friend now.

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And he had me working with him over the

summers and sort of being a bit of a,

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sort of, Going out, shadowing him on

the property stuff he'd done, he'd done

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quite a few big office developments,

industrial developments that, the

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likes of kind of some of the stuff in

Llanysan Trading Estate where he built.

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Um, so he was If no one's familiar,

just to interrupt there, Luz, if no

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one's familiar with, um, Carliferia,

Llanysan is a Lovely area, really nice.

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And it's, it's a mixture, isn't it?

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It's got some, um, trading.

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It's got a lot of residential, yeah.

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It's like about 10 minutes

drive from the city.

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So, yeah.

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And it was really, yeah, apologies.

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I need to give context on that.

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And he, he was obviously quite an

accomplished property developer.

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Anyway, he took me under his wing.

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And he knew a lot of the guys in, sort of,

I say guys, and that's quite an important

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thing to come back to that in a minute.

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Yeah.

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That was a slip of the tongue.

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Yeah.

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I'm not.

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They, it just goes to show.

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Yeah.

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So I ended up, he was very, very good

friends with the, with the national

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brands at the time that was called King

Sturge and they were based all over the

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UK and they had regional offices and I was

doing, again, started doing the summers

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with them and then, sort of, they offered

me a placement, um, and they offered me

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a job following my university degree.

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Because that, it started, that sort

of inspiration sort of started,

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if you like, from the age of

sort of 16, 17, and just grew.

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And that's how I got into it.

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And you know, The next steps then.

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But it kind of opened doors for

me by being under his wing and him

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having the contacts and me seeing

what he'd achieved and what he'd done

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and I thought, oh, I could do this.

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And yeah, I was just gonna ask,

was that a big thing to see?

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Oh, look how, look how

far or well he's done.

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And I want a bit of that.

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Yeah.

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And I kind of, I, I really,

it was really exciting.

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It was really the whole architecture

has always really interested me.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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I'm not your typical person

just to walk down the street.

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I will walk down the street and I

will be looking up at a bird around

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me because I love these buildings.

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And, you know, I bore my husband's a

bit sometimes because I'll say, Oh my

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God, look at the, you know, look at

the front facade and that building.

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Really?

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You know, whilst you're

thinking about what time the

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football match is on, you know?

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So, it's just But it'd be boring

though if we had all the same

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interests though, wouldn't it?

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Yeah, absolutely.

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Come on, yeah.

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Absolutely, and yeah, and I think that's

what inspired me, was that ability, and

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I suppose I quite liked architecture,

you know, I liked that side of, that

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was an avenue as well, but for me, the

commercial property sort of scene, I just

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really enjoyed, and then I sort of Mm hmm.

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He started looking about what a

surveyor was about and I thought,

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well, that's quite interesting.

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And yeah, you went from there.

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Yeah, it is.

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Let's go back to that thing you should

have come back to about the guys.

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Flip of the tongue.

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It's funny because, you know, I

think back to my university course.

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And so I, I studied in, um, the, trying

to think what it's actually called.

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University of the West of England.

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Oh yeah.

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Yeah.

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It was around the time I was supposed

to be going to the Morgan, but.

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The RACS, the Royal Institute of

Charter Surveyors stripped the, um,

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university of the accreditation because

the standards, they were starting

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to go back literally just before

I was about to go to university.

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Um, so I went, yeah, it was

quite a mad time because it

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affected quite a lot of people.

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And I got an offer to, um, Reading,

got an offer to Liverpool John

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Moores and got an offer to Bristol.

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So I just decided to go to Bristol.

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Hmm.

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And the amalgamation, of course, is

with things like, oh, I don't know,

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business in property, um, you know,

investments in property, all these kind

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of things, various different titles.

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But we, and we used to do

a lot of lectures together.

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And I remember my course in

particular, which was a, you

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know, sort of property management,

asset management sort of led role.

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There was four girls on the

course of a total of around 22.

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And the reason I said about the

amalgamation of the other was quite

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important as well, because likewise,

you know, you think spread across

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all of these courses that were coming

together, joint lectures out of a

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handful, you know, I think back to our

lectures and our lecturers as well.

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But they all mail.

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Yeah, I didn't have one lecturer, and I

didn't have, um, yeah, I didn't have one

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female lecturer, and I think probably

there were about four females per course.

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It's crazy, isn't it?

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It is crazy, and it is mad, and then,

you know, when we talk then about kind

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of, I said the slip of the tongue,

you know, from then, from what I said

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about the guys, I think back to those

times when I was early days in King's

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Sturge, And sadly, the only females that

were there were, and I hope I get this

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right, because if, if somebody was to

listen, but this was about, you know,

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I think there was one female management

surveyor, which you often used to get

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the manic, the female, the token female.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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And I think the rest of the team were all

male because, but the only female were

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the admin staff and the it was like, I

would say that's probably about right.

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There was one secretary per

two, you know, surveyors.

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Yeah.

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Everything was typed

up and everything else.

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So there was, you know, he was an

office manager that was female.

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It was just, that was just the thing, you

know, and I, and even as a graduate as

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well, in, because of course there used to

be a lot of things, the Cardiff graduates.

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Yeah.

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Again, you know, I was the only female

industrial surveyor at the time.

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That's crazy, isn't it?

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And this is going back 20 years.

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Yeah, so you know, yeah, actually

that long ago is that it's not I guess

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you know things, I would, I would

like to think things have moved on.

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Let's just touch on that though so you

are, you know, in uni, you're surrounded

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by predominantly males in, Not just your

course, but from the lecturers as well.

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Did that make you more determined?

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Did it have, actually, no,

did it have any impact?

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Did you even notice it back then?

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Not really, because I've always been,

um, I've been always quite an ambitious

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and determined individual anyway.

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I mean, my, my dad, you know, it

makes me laugh, and he doesn't

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realise how MPC it is to say it,

but he used to call me a squat.

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You know, and that's that.

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And he still says it now.

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You always were a sport, Lucy.

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Yeah, you always were.

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And he says it, but actually

now we know, you know, I'd

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never say that to my children.

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That was just a generational thing.

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But yeah.

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So no matter, I think I

was always quite academic.

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You know, I always wanted to

achieve and achieve highly.

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I just, that was always my way.

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And I always wanted to

do something properly.

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So whether or not I subconsciously,

you know, push myself harder

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or not, I don't really know.

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I don't, I don't think it

would have made any difference.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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That's just the person you are anyway.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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It certainly made me more aware

of it as I've gone through life.

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Certainly, you know, I'm sure we'll

touch upon it, you know, things to

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do with management opportunities and

things like that, um, which I think I

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have been impacted by being a female.

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Um, and, and, and I, and I, you

know, a maternity cover, you know,

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maternity leave and having to

So, but in those early stages, I

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certainly wasn't consciously aware.

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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That's really interesting because

like, knowing you, I can imagine it

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probably wouldn't have made, and I'm

glad you kind of said that it wouldn't

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have made much difference because

that's the kind of person you are.

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You want to succeed and you want

to get on in your way, regardless

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of if, you know, gender or whether

you, you know, you identify as, but

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let's, let's just talk about that.

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So that was my next question, actually,

and you obviously read my mind.

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What, what sort of challenges, um,

I'm going to use the word challenge.

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Yeah.

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Did you come up against in,

in the, or have you come up

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against in the time as being.

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Identified as a female.

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I think there's a couple of things that

strike me and I've got to be careful

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of how I say this and what I say

because obviously, you know, I don't

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necessarily like to sit on, you know,

that shelf that sort of, oh, I'm a woman.

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I'm, you know, I, it's,

it's actually, yeah.

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You know, I've achieved what

I've achieved, um, and I'm happy

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with what I've achieved so far.

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And actually, yes, I've had certain gender

barriers and yes, I've kind of, there has

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been times, um, which, yeah, which I could

have taken things further, shall we say?

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Yeah.

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Yeah, which I've chosen not to, because

actually, again, It could have been

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detriment to me and my reputation and,

and I don't like to, you know, I've,

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I've been able to prove myself without

actually throwing my weight around saying

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that this is, you know, this is a person.

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I love that.

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Yeah.

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Do you know what I mean?

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I, I bloody love that.

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Will you say that again?

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Honestly, I've proven myself

without having to throw my weight

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around about if I'm male or female.

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You've just done it.

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Yeah.

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And I genuinely think that's

a big thing because I.

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It, it does, it does annoy me.

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You know?

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And, and I'm not a feminist.

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I'm not a fe, but you know,

I'm not, not a feminist.

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I'm not a feminist, you know?

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Yeah.

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But it does annoy me that there is

sometimes this, this whole sort of thing

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about women, you know, not getting a

position or, you know, there's not enough

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women on the boards and things like this.

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Mm.

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And then you become a token woman

in this, and, and, and I don't.

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Agree with that stance on things because

actually you, you're, you don't have to be

384

:

female or male to be good at what you do.

385

:

And, you know, if you can prove it,

then I think that's a big thing.

386

:

And that's what I've ultimately,

ultimately maintained, you know, because,

387

:

and yeah, people come to you because

of reputation, because of what you've

388

:

done and I think that's a big thing.

389

:

You, you know.

390

:

You could be male and could

be awful at what you do.

391

:

You just, you know.

392

:

Yeah, yeah.

393

:

And that's so true.

394

:

And I, you know, I'm often in the middle.

395

:

I'm like, you know, can't make a, can't

make a decision as well sometimes.

396

:

Yeah.

397

:

You know, and I get it.

398

:

I get it.

399

:

And I think I love that, what you just

said about, you know, you've, you've,

400

:

you've done what you've done on your own

merit, regardless of, of being a female.

401

:

Yeah.

402

:

And, you know, and, and

has I got a lot of male.

403

:

allies as well as female allies.

404

:

Yeah, yeah.

405

:

And people, and, and, and I'm

happy to support that the other

406

:

way around as well, you know.

407

:

Yeah.

408

:

I think, yeah.

409

:

Absolutely.

410

:

And you know, on that though, and I'm,

I'm very agree with what you said, but

411

:

I think on, on merit as well, let's

actually lean into the fact that you're

412

:

still You're still really predominantly

in a, in a, in a male driven industry, but

413

:

you've proven that you don't, you don't

have to be male to get where you are.

414

:

No, absolutely.

415

:

I mean, you know, arguably, yes, it's

probably constrained me in some ways,

416

:

but I've looked for the opportunities

when there's been those pushbacks.

417

:

And I think, and I think

that's a big thing.

418

:

You know, there's a lot of, there's

always, The talk of, or it's, you

419

:

know, jobs for the boys kind of thing.

420

:

And, you know, and I always, and it's

quite funny, you know, I play golf and,

421

:

you know, you see a lot of the guys

playing golf and things like this, I get

422

:

asked what my handicap is and it's kind

of, Oh, you know, it's, it's, and it's

423

:

always great to have that answer back

as well, because they are starting out

424

:

and it's like, Oh, come to our golf day.

425

:

Yeah.

426

:

And then I have a conversation.

427

:

I mean, but ultimately, I, you

know, I do think, yeah, you,

428

:

you look for those opportunities

if you get pushbacks on others.

429

:

Yeah.

430

:

Yeah.

431

:

Brilliant.

432

:

Is there anything that you would do or

have you done differently in You know the

433

:

last, this is a big question now isn't

it really, in the last 20 years that you

434

:

go oh actually yeah maybe I would have

done x y differently to achieve something

435

:

a bit faster or or gone a bit slower.

436

:

Is there anything that really stands out

you think you would have done differently?

437

:

I, it's funny because I, I do reflection

every now and again, you know when

438

:

you set your goals and things like

that and obviously work we've done.

439

:

And, you know, your, your journal

and things like that, where you,

440

:

where you reflect on what you,

where you've come from and where

441

:

you are now and where you're going.

442

:

And, uh, it's funny because I

actually see it the other way in

443

:

that, you know, I got made redundant

in:

444

:

And actually, I was very complacent.

445

:

I had my comfort blanket.

446

:

Yeah.

447

:

And I remember vividly walking.

448

:

We were living up in

Gloucester at the time.

449

:

And I remember it was snow

because it was around February.

450

:

And I remember walking.

451

:

We didn't have a dog or anything.

452

:

I just went for a walk because I was.

453

:

I thought it was a reflection on me that

I'd been made redundant and, and I walked

454

:

the streets around the house thinking,

cause I just needed that time out.

455

:

And I thought, Hmm, this is

that push I actually needed.

456

:

And actually, you know, it's funny

because, you know, leaving the business

457

:

last year, which, you know, we've talked

about and, um, and actually it's kind of

458

:

sometimes These things happen when you

don't realize they're going to happen.

459

:

And actually they happen for a reason.

460

:

And therefore, you know, to have that

regret or that, or actually would

461

:

I've done something kind of thing, not

necessarily regret, but the thing of, or

462

:

would I've done something differently?

463

:

I reflect on those incidents actually,

rather than actually thinking about

464

:

and thinking about, well, what,

where did that junction then take me?

465

:

And I have to say 2009 was a quite an

important part, you know, point in time in

466

:

my life because I into the retail world.

467

:

Yeah, absolutely.

468

:

And, you know, exactly.

469

:

I had a job offer from, you know, Tesco.

470

:

I had a job offer from Store 21 and I

had another offer from a company who did

471

:

a lot of work for retail down in Oxford.

472

:

And I would never have got

into that position had it not

473

:

been being made redundant.

474

:

So I think every.

475

:

You know, these things, these life

events happen for a reason and often

476

:

happen when almost kind of naturally,

you're ready for that change.

477

:

Yes, absolutely.

478

:

I'm a massive believer

in fate and, you know.

479

:

Yeah, something's happening for a reason.

480

:

Yeah, and it comes on, before we came on

live, we were trying to think of a phrase.

481

:

We were talking about letting

go of certain clients and

482

:

opportunities and things like that.

483

:

And there was a phrase, and I

still can't pledge you remember it.

484

:

What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.

485

:

That's it, what doesn't

kill you makes you stronger.

486

:

What doesn't kill you makes you stronger.

487

:

And it's, it's something

that, Well, I can remember it.

488

:

Actually, it kind of does resonate with

me as well, because, you know, these

489

:

things are out of your control, right?

490

:

The, the redundancy is out of

your control, and it's what you

491

:

can take from those opportunities

then, will make you stronger.

492

:

And, you know, the likelihood of, if

that hadn't happened, we, I don't know,

493

:

we may never have met, because you would

still be living in Gloucester, you know?

494

:

All of these, all of these things

come around full circle, don't they?

495

:

Absolutely.

496

:

Um, so.

497

:

Let's just talk about a little

bit how, how we did meet and I

498

:

mentioned the beginning we, we

met at a, a local networking.

499

:

I think we were just chatting about

like, getting focused and how we

500

:

really focus on goals and how we

stay productive and focus and then.

501

:

You reached out to me a couple of

weeks later, wasn't it, saying,

502

:

oh, I'd love to have a chat.

503

:

And I was like, oh God, yeah, great.

504

:

And you said something about like,

oh, you know, you really helped

505

:

me in that short space of time.

506

:

And it's funny because that's just,

I was just talking in general, you

507

:

know, it's what I do all the time.

508

:

Um, but you realized at that point

you needed some, Somebody that wasn't

509

:

already in your world, in your, you

know, in your present company to go,

510

:

right, I need somebody to help with

whatever it is we worked on, the focus.

511

:

Yeah, I think it was confidence

and focus, wasn't it?

512

:

And I think that was the big thing.

513

:

And, you know, sort of that ability

to kind of, um, to move forward

514

:

from something that You know, a life

event and something that had gone on.

515

:

And I remember you, I remember telling

you that I'd sort of interviewed, you

516

:

know, let's call it interview more like,

you know, you have an informal chat

517

:

with people sort of from a business

coach sort of, um, you know, sort of

518

:

role and, and you and I click, cause

I think you got it because you'd been

519

:

from a retail background and across.

520

:

It's my passion too.

521

:

And, you know, that ability to understand

what I'm talking about when we're

522

:

talking about shopping centres and

retail and all that kind of malarkey.

523

:

All the stuff that you and I love.

524

:

I couldn't be more boring for some people.

525

:

It's like double Dutch.

526

:

It's like, what the hell are we on about?

527

:

You know?

528

:

So, yeah.

529

:

Yeah.

530

:

And I think we just gelled and similar,

as we said, similar age group, you know,

531

:

so kind of nice to be able to talk it

through and putting those things in

532

:

place then to help me kind of focus as

to, you know, the, the sort of KPIs we

533

:

put in place and those kinds of things.

534

:

And there's focus about thinking

about, right, where do I want

535

:

to get milestones, et cetera.

536

:

And yeah, and I'd love to just take a

couple of steps back there if we can.

537

:

So.

538

:

And not really to do with me, but what,

when did you realize that, you know, you

539

:

were, you were busy, you were doing, you

were doing well, what you're, what you're

540

:

doing, but you, you realize that actually,

I can't do this on my own right now.

541

:

I need some, I need some support.

542

:

Were you at that stage where you

were thinking, right, I'm going to

543

:

burn out, or I'm going to go in a

direction I'm not going to go in?

544

:

What really hit home with you and

thought, right, I need, I need

545

:

to do something here for Lucy?

546

:

So, so it's obviously difficult to talk

about, um, but essentially, I mean, I kind

547

:

of got to a place at the back end of 2022

and realized that being in a business, you

548

:

know, sharing the business with somebody

else and, and being, you know, director

549

:

of another business and not being it, not

being my own, shall we say, I was getting

550

:

quite frustrated with, and I wanted,

you know, A lot of sort of who I was

551

:

working with my own clients and I wanted

to actually work and have those clients

552

:

solely in my business perspective and then

also be able to decide the journey and

553

:

the path that my business wanted to take.

554

:

Therefore, I was the curator

of that, rather than having

555

:

to make decisions on my own.

556

:

With somebody else, I think

that was a big thing for me.

557

:

And it was taking that step of,

you know, I went to the States in

558

:

October 22 and on a family holiday.

559

:

And I remember just having that

time out, you know, I remember

560

:

vividly sort of lying on a, on a

sun lounger in this fabulous hotel.

561

:

We were staying in thinking, right.

562

:

I've just got to do it.

563

:

I've got to, I've got to take that gem.

564

:

But at the time I was thinking,

you know, I had a number of clients

565

:

saying to me, you can do it.

566

:

And I, at the time I was thinking,

well, can I, can I, so I decided over

567

:

Christmas, that was it, you know, I

was going to tell my business partner

568

:

that I was wanting to leave and.

569

:

Decided then, you know, early January

to set the business up and, and that's

570

:

where we got to really in the case of,

you know, let's go for it and let's do it.

571

:

And then that obviously.

572

:

At that point, because I was kind of in

quite a vulnerable, sensitive place, I

573

:

suppose, if you like, I just thought I

needed that extra support and somebody

574

:

to be able to provide me with the tools

to help me sort of think about, look,

575

:

you know, you know, I know I can do it,

but confidence to know you can do it.

576

:

And to make those next steps.

577

:

And that's where, you know,

where we got to really.

578

:

Yeah.

579

:

In a nutshell.

580

:

Yeah.

581

:

No, and thanks.

582

:

Thanks for sharing that.

583

:

Thanks for being so, so honest as well.

584

:

And, and the reason I wanted to, to

get you to, to really just say that is.

585

:

I think a lot of people get stuck and

a lot of people don't have that, the

586

:

confidence or, you know, the support

even, or the drive or the want to go,

587

:

do you know what, I'm meant for more.

588

:

And I want to be, like you said,

I love that phrase, the creator of

589

:

your own journey, um, and then, you

know, having somebody, whoever that

590

:

is, whatever that looks like, you

know, it could just be talking to

591

:

your friend, your partner, whoever.

592

:

But someone independent, I think.

593

:

Yeah, it is better.

594

:

And I think, I just think somebody

who, you know, we didn't really know

595

:

each other at that point in time.

596

:

You don't know any of my history and

actually I can sit and talk to you about

597

:

actually, this is what I'm thinking.

598

:

What do you think?

599

:

This is what I want to achieve.

600

:

This is what I want to get out of it.

601

:

And the ability to kind of, You

know, just kind of set up a path

602

:

really is where you take it.

603

:

And, and it's funny, and it's funny what

you're saying, because I've had many

604

:

a conversation with friends and peers.

605

:

And if they listen to this,

they'll know who they are.

606

:

They've sort of said to

me, how did you do it?

607

:

You know, how did you do it?

608

:

How do you find, and

listen, it isn't blooming

609

:

straightforward and it's not easy.

610

:

And, you know, You know, you know,

one of my friends very well and her

611

:

and I have had this conversation

about when you're running a business,

612

:

but he thinks it's very glamorous.

613

:

And, you know, you can Friday whenever

you fancy, you know, you can go for

614

:

lunch, you know, whenever you think so.

615

:

It is flipping hard.

616

:

The worry of your pipeline and, and, you

know, your competition and what you, you

617

:

know, yeah, your competition and what

they're doing and what they're doing.

618

:

Yeah.

619

:

And you know, yeah, sorry.

620

:

Yeah, no, I was going to say, and

that's, that's so true because yes,

621

:

you can choose to finish when you want,

you can choose to take those lunches

622

:

and we'll come on to a bit of self

care and how we look after each, you

623

:

know, you as a person in a bit, but.

624

:

But actually there's, there's so much

more that comes with, with having your

625

:

own business, running your own business.

626

:

You know, you are, you

are the brand, right?

627

:

You are the brand.

628

:

And you become head of HR, head of

finance, head of IT, head of sales,

629

:

head of marketing, all of these things.

630

:

Yeah.

631

:

And this is why I say though, like,

yes, you are all those people.

632

:

But get the support around you, you

know, find those people that actually,

633

:

it might be not, it might not be

your zone of genius to, you know,

634

:

all about your finances, that's okay.

635

:

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

636

:

Don't think you have to

do it all on your own.

637

:

And if you're in a position where

you can outsource or get, you know,

638

:

really undertake some free classes

or something or spend a bit of

639

:

money, absolutely do that because

otherwise you'll get to a point where.

640

:

You don't do any of it because you've

burnt out and you don't and it's funny

641

:

because I always remember someone saying

to me as I was sort of progressing

642

:

at the kind of career ladder that

it was, it was actually my old boss.

643

:

He said to me that as soon as you become

that sort of head of doing the fun stuff.

644

:

Yeah, the stuff that you originally

did, you know, the deals making all

645

:

that kind of stuff, because all of a

sudden you are writing contracts, you

646

:

know, as in employment contracts, you're

trying to keep on top of your P and L,

647

:

you know, and it's things like that.

648

:

And it's, and it's funny, cause I'm just

in the process of changing my accountant

649

:

for this reason, because I've got a

new accountancy firm coming on board.

650

:

They help with businesses

that are scaling up.

651

:

They do things on your HR, you know, they,

they offer this fully fledged service.

652

:

And I, that will, even though it's a

bit more expensive, the way I looked

653

:

at it is that actually the money

that I've got to spend a little bit

654

:

more will save me time and I can

carry on with my value adds stuff.

655

:

You know, yeah, exactly.

656

:

You're so right there.

657

:

You're so right.

658

:

Because actually a lot of people get

scared of investing and I'm glad you just

659

:

said that because people think, Oh, but

I can't afford to pay for an account.

660

:

I can't afford to do that.

661

:

But actually, what are you

going to gain from doing that?

662

:

Right?

663

:

What are you going to gain

from spending a bit of money?

664

:

You're going to get more energy.

665

:

I'm actually going back to the things.

666

:

The reason why you've set up a business

is to do with the enjoyment side of it.

667

:

Yeah.

668

:

Okay.

669

:

So if you did want to clock off at, you

know, two o'clock on a Friday, if you

670

:

did want to go for lunch for somebody,

how do you actually do that now?

671

:

How do you look after Lucy King?

672

:

Well, it's funny, actually, because having

said all that, I've just, I've had quite

673

:

a tough week with, uh, and my husband

said to me the other day, he said, He was,

674

:

he's off on Friday, this, tomorrow, and

he said, can I take you for breakfast?

675

:

Yeah, you can!

676

:

Yes!

677

:

Did you say yes straight away?

678

:

Yeah!

679

:

I thought, it's funny, because I thought,

after the week I've had, I thought, you

680

:

know what, actually, it's nothing best.

681

:

And actually, tomorrow afternoon, um,

as you know, I've got the horses, I'm

682

:

actually going to go riding the horse.

683

:

I'm going to go out for breakfast in

the morning, and I'm going to ride

684

:

the horse then in the afternoon.

685

:

Brilliant.

686

:

brilliant because actually, you know,

I think self-care, I've realized, you

687

:

know, I, I think back to that time

in October when I was on holiday,

688

:

when I was literally, yeah, on

the verge of a breakdown and, and.

689

:

I went and bought the horse actually

not long after he came for this very

690

:

reason, it's kind of like, it's that

ability to with children, of course,

691

:

you've got to look after them, you

know, and obviously, you know, But

692

:

they're in the house with you, you

know, you can make them tea, et cetera.

693

:

You can juggle at home with working.

694

:

The nice thing is with the horse is

that, you know, okay, yeah, we've got a

695

:

loaner that will cover them a couple of

days a week, but most nights I've got

696

:

to go down and I've got to sort her out.

697

:

Yeah.

698

:

Well, both of them out now.

699

:

And, um, and it's like, you know, Okay.

700

:

I've got, I've got, you know,

you've got responsibilities now.

701

:

Yeah, yeah.

702

:

You've gotta, you've handed another

two children to your life early.

703

:

Yeah, exactly.

704

:

Exactly.

705

:

So I've gotta get, you know, I've

gotta be able to do that now.

706

:

Okay.

707

:

That might mean I've gotta be back in

front of my laptop at seven o'clock,

708

:

but that's a choice that I make.

709

:

Yeah.

710

:

And you know, the balancing act and you

know, and you've benefited from it, right?

711

:

Absolutely.

712

:

'cause actually.

713

:

You know, yeah, and your time

that, and I'm so glad you're in

714

:

a place where you can go, yeah,

actually take me for breakfast.

715

:

I'm going to go riding

because you know what?

716

:

Nobody is going to die if you take

a Friday afternoon off, right?

717

:

We are not, I say this all the time.

718

:

We are not life saving,

you know, heart surgeons.

719

:

It's okay if we can step away.

720

:

It's okay.

721

:

And often I've, you know, read a few

books, which basically, you know, it's

722

:

the whole thing about the burnout.

723

:

It's about, you know, sort of self

preservation and these kind of things.

724

:

If I was just to work full on day

tomorrow, I wouldn't be motivated.

725

:

I would be gutted because I'd

missed out on breakfast with Rich.

726

:

Yeah.

727

:

And, you know, I would be, you know,

on Facebook on, you know, Yeah.

728

:

The socials.

729

:

Yeah.

730

:

You know, staring out the window

actually by taking that time out

731

:

tomorrow means I'll come back into

the office on Monday morning or even

732

:

Sunday night because that's most of

the time and actually be motivated

733

:

all over to do it all again because I

will be better frame of mind because

734

:

I've had that time out just to reflect

and have some time out away from it.

735

:

And actually, and I, do you know what

I think is so, so important and I,

736

:

and it's funny because I listened

to Rachel Flanagan, um, who again,

737

:

very inspirational individual.

738

:

And she has done, you know, you know,

testing gender, you know, sort of

739

:

stereotypes and things like this,

you know, she's done incredible.

740

:

And she, she basically said, and I thought

this is brilliant that she every year.

741

:

Takes herself off.

742

:

They, they go on some sort of

walking, some hiking for like a

743

:

week, 10 days, something like this.

744

:

She was saying, and she did it in

a, she said it in a talk recently.

745

:

And she said every year

she's already booked.

746

:

She goes just because she has

some time out and that's the time.

747

:

Okay.

748

:

It's not with a family, but it's

her time for her to have that,

749

:

you know, that time away from it.

750

:

Um, and I think it is.

751

:

And, um, I remember when we, you know,

around the fifth time when we met,

752

:

it was, what do we do for you, Liz?

753

:

And you were like, um, um, it was very

much that kind of like, oh, nothing.

754

:

Right.

755

:

Okay.

756

:

Well, let's build some of that in.

757

:

And I'm just, I'm so happy.

758

:

And I love what you said, right?

759

:

It'll still be there Monday.

760

:

You're going to be more motivated.

761

:

Um, because again, if you work

tomorrow, you're just going to be sat,

762

:

I think you're going to be probably,

you know, whatever you're working on.

763

:

You're not going to give it your

all because your mind's going

764

:

to be thinking somewhere else.

765

:

I call it daydream Dolly, you

know, that's what I'll be.

766

:

I won't be concentrating at all.

767

:

Or Dolly the daydreamer.

768

:

Dolly the daydreamer.

769

:

Yeah, that does.

770

:

Okay, so.

771

:

For anybody that's thinking of starting

out on your own, you know, if you're in a

772

:

position where you were thinking, right,

I need to, I need to kind of break free

773

:

or let go from, from what I'm doing.

774

:

What is there a top tip

that you've got for them?

775

:

I think the more you procrastinate

about thinking about it, more self

776

:

doubt you'll put into your mind.

777

:

So if you've got, if you've got an,

sort of an itch, just go and do it.

778

:

I mean, the things I think that you can

put in place to give yourself some comfort

779

:

that, because often a lot of it is doubts

around where your book of business is and

780

:

where that is going to be, you know, you

know, if you are leaving, you know, sort

781

:

of one of the biggies, you know, the big

sort of entities in, You know, the UK,

782

:

the sort of the consultancy firms, et

cetera, which are turning over quite a

783

:

bit of money, et cetera, you will already

have existing clients now, you know,

784

:

it may not be that you can target those

because you might have non compete, et

785

:

cetera, but you know, there's ways and

means to, to have those conversations.

786

:

And I think, you know, a lot of these,

these people will be working for bigger

787

:

organizations and we'll be wanting to

make the leap and their clients, you

788

:

know, We'll be there because of them,

not because of the actual organization.

789

:

It's often you, that person

rather than the organization.

790

:

And, and I think, you know,

that would go for any industry.

791

:

If you've got that down,

you've got that itch.

792

:

And I, and I, and I think it's.

793

:

Yeah, it's an interesting one because

I think, ultimately, if you've got that

794

:

itch, that itch will demotivate you.

795

:

Yeah, absolutely.

796

:

It's like, go and scratch it, right?

797

:

Yeah.

798

:

You know, the likelihood

is you can always return.

799

:

Exactly.

800

:

You can always return.

801

:

That's what a number of people said to

me when I was my little self doubter.

802

:

Yeah, amazing.

803

:

Amazing.

804

:

Right, I could talk to you for days,

um, because I'm so, and obviously

805

:

I love property and backgrounds, we

haven't even touched on that really.

806

:

Um, a really important question

for you now, Liz, if you had to

807

:

choose now, and you couldn't spend

all day procrastinating, what

808

:

would be your favourite cake?

809

:

Oh, I think a jam donut.

810

:

I love a jam donut.

811

:

I love a jam donut.

812

:

Sorry, I've laughed so much that

nobody's ever said a jam donut before.

813

:

Jam donut.

814

:

It's really simple.

815

:

Yeah, because, you know, you just

think about it and then they try and,

816

:

they try and complicate it by making

it vanilla or chocolate or blueberry.

817

:

Yeah, just if you want a donut,

just have a bloody jam donut.

818

:

Jam donut.

819

:

Love it.

820

:

They, do you know what, yeah, you can

get like four for, did you say like

821

:

four for a quid, that sort of thing?

822

:

I don't know.

823

:

I've had a jam donut for years.

824

:

And most places sell them, so you

never have issues over, you know.

825

:

Yeah, you can't get a

jam donut, love that.

826

:

I'm a simple girl, like the

daydream whilst eating a donut.

827

:

I love it.

828

:

Right.

829

:

If people are interested in getting

in touch with you for any aspect of

830

:

what you do, how can they find you?

831

:

Amazing.

832

:

Um, they, well, I've got my website.

833

:

So, um, www.

834

:

gellarproperty.

835

:

co.

836

:

uk or they can easily drop me an

email at lucy at gellarproperty.

837

:

co.

838

:

uk Wow.

839

:

That's probably the way.

840

:

Great.

841

:

And you're on LinkedIn?

842

:

On LinkedIn?

843

:

Yeah.

844

:

LinkedIn investment.

845

:

Best ones.

846

:

Yeah, absolutely.

847

:

Um, yeah.

848

:

Amazing.

849

:

Thank you so, so much.

850

:

It's been an absolute

pleasure having you on.

851

:

Thanks.

852

:

I've really enjoyed it.

853

:

I've really, I, yeah, I was really

nervous about doing a first podcast.

854

:

Oh, really?

855

:

Enjoyed it.

856

:

Podcast version has smashed it.

857

:

Absolutely.

858

:

Thank you very much.

859

:

Thank you, Lucy.

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About the Podcast

Fabulous & Female
Hello and welcome to Fabulous & Female! For women who are running their own businesses and want advice, guidance and great tips that they can take forward for business growth, better balanced life and most importantly to avoid burnout, then this is for you!

Featuring fantastic guest interviews, you will get to hear inspirational stories behind successful female entrepreneurs, plus the real life dramas that happen behind the scenes. Between guest interviews, listen in to hear the host talk about her own business experiences and share tips and knowledge gained over many years of business life, plus the huge changes made from bricks and mortar businesses to coaching.

Each week, these honest, funny and ‘keeping it real’ conversations show the ups and downs in the life of an entrepreneur.

Follow Helen
https://linktr.ee/Helencorsicadmore

About your host

Profile picture for Helen Corsi-Cadmore

Helen Corsi-Cadmore

Helen Corsi-Cadmore:
An award-winning Business, Mindset and Fertility Coach, an NLP Master practitioner, Hypnotherapist and mum to twin girls.
Having built a successful career in property, and then turning her hand to owning a large multi-million-pound retail business, Helen is now a successful coach that helps people achieve their true desires by being a positive disruption!
Huge lover of fresh air, coffee and cake and dogs!

Jane Mack:
A bestselling Author, Visibility Coach, and mum to two boys.
Jane’s first business was a successful holiday letting agency she owned with her husband before selling it to a national company. She moved into business consultancy before realising a passion for coaching.
After going through her own visibility journey she now helps women be visible in their businesses, because she believes no one should feel they have to hide because of fear.